splinteredstar (![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
splinteredstar) wrote2016-01-16 01:00 pm
splinteredstar) wrote2016-01-16 01:00 pm
Entry tags:
on the redemption of kylo ren
I've spent a lot of time since watching TFA thinking about Kylo Ren. (I've spent most of my time going !!! and squeeing, and looking mournfully at all the merch I cannot afford, but, regardless.) And I know, the world hardly needs more villain fangirls, and there are so many fabulous characters in TFA that will probably not get enough attention. Surely, as an ethical and aware fandom participant, I should spend my time talking about Rey or Finn or Leia, instead of adding to the inevitable pile of discussion about Yet Another Grimdark White Boy.
And yet, and yet. My attention goes where it will, and there's a lot more going on than that. There's something /compelling/ about this boy to me, and I want to poke around in his brain. One of the main questions currently, considering his backstory, his behavior, and the patterns of Star Wars- will he get a redemption arc? And on the meta level - /should/ he?
There are several issues that interact here, which makes things complicated. A meta analysis functions on two levels - its interactions with the culture is exists in and its interaction with the reader in question. Obviously, these two things are iterative - my reaction is a part of the culture and the culture is made up of a collection of individual reactions. But basically, it boils down to what it means to Society and what it means to Me. Both are important to that question of "should"- but they're not always the same thing.
Every social group in nerd culture has That Guy. He's the guy who brags about his kill count in games but whenever you play a co-op with him he fucks up and blames lag or cheaters. He's the guy who invents new bullshit powers in a table top rpg just so that his character is always the most overpowered on the board. He'll talk down to you for not having the entire back catalog of a comic or for not having memorized the entire lore of a world - but it's okay, because he's willing to teach you, especially if that means he can flirt with you or get a date for 'helping.' He's that guy who's just a /little/ too into Heath Ledger's Joker. He is the bane of every convention, the curse of any message board, and everyone's least favorite person in a campaign. He will throw an absolute fit if a game doesn't go his way, or if a campaign gets out of his control, or if - heaven forbid - a girl turns him down.
I am willing to bet that 75% of the people in nerd culture, especially those who presented female at the time, have a particular person in mind when reading that description. We have /all/ known this boy. I've probably known five or six of them myself. (I don't doubt that female versions exist, but I haven't personally encountered one.) It is very possible that, if a female-presenting person gets turned away from nerd culture, or gets the impression that it's not for them and that there's no place in it for them, it's because of That Guy.
Give That Guy a light saber and the black coat his mother won't let him buy, and you would get something pretty close to how Kylo Ren acts in the movie. I know several people who have had a visceral negative reaction to the character, because they recognized That Guy and That Guy ruined their fucking week at least once.
For decades, That Guy was a powerful force in nerd culture. Grimdark is aimed specifically at him - fuel for his power fantasies, with beautiful women who fall over him and every excuse to wreak violence on the world without repurcussions. The media was created for him, and supported his view of himself and the world. If it did not support his view, it would be ignored or re-interpreted until it did. (Think of the reputation for badassery that Boba Fett has, which in the context of the OT is /completely unearned/.) For decades, the Star Wars fandom was indemic with Those Guys, and many of them feel that Star Wars is theirs.
Kylo Ren is That Guy - but he was not created for him. He is not a power fantasy but the subversion of one. He is what That Guy looks like to everyone else - not powerful, not fearsome, not in control. All of the darkness and growling and drama is a bluff and the movie makes it incredibly clear that /everyone can tell/. He is as clear a sign post as you can get - this story is not catering to That Guy. Star Wars does not belong to That Guy, and they want That Guy to know it.
And personally, that is /fucking amazing/. Between the villain Kylo Ren and the heroine Ray, there is a now a spot in Star Wars for me. Suddenly, a universe that has been a part of the background radiation of my life is fully open to me - the people who would exclude me from it have no right to, and the text itself makes sure that they know that they are the villians in this story. If Kylo Ren stays as he is, without redemption or any justification, he will already have done something important. I know a lot of people who want him to stay the way he is, because really, fuck That Guy. And that is important and valid!
But I react a little bit differently, and it took me a few weeks to figure out why.
This is the point where I move into conjecture. This is not canon, though I like to think it is, at least, canon-supported. This is why I, personally, /want/ him to get a redemption arc - though I'm not certain that's the best term.
I've read, well, a lot of Kylo Ren fic lately. And I've noticed certain patterns - a lot of people, especially those who are marginally sympathetic to him, write him as mentally ill. Now, most people don't pin a diagnosis to him (possibly because mentally ill villains are a goddamned minefield, which I'll get into in a moment) but they do ascribe a set of symptoms to him that I recognize: biploar disorder. Specifically, his impulsiveness, temper, and lack of self control are written (perhaps unintentionally) as signs of a manic episode. I've also seen paranoid schizophrenic suggested, as well as other disorders. It's generally agreed - there is /something/ wrong here.
If Kylo Ren was taken in by Snoke as a child, as I've seen evidence for, then that adds abuse and grooming to the balance. Abuse, especially as long term and systemic as this would have been, would also contribute to emotional instability and poor impulse control. Mental illness makes one vulnerable to manipulation, and the manipulation worsens underlying mental illness.
(Full disclosure: I am not bipolar, nor was I abused as Kylo seems to have been. I do, however, have chronic depression, anxiety issues, and delusions. Also, this section has been checked over by someone who /is/ bipolar, and has my gratitude for the second set of eyes.)
The problem here is that mental illness (and abuse, which is usually folded in) and villiany have a long and unpleasant history. There are two main narratives on mental illness and villainy in fiction. There is the serial killer who is sick in the mind, who was born evil and has to be locked up for the good of the world before they hurt people - and then there's the idea that it's not their fault, they don't know any better, they can't help it.
And I hate both of these narratives.
As someone who is mentally ill, I can't stand the idea that I was doomed from birth to become a monster, that I am nothing more than a function of my disease. As someone who loves and has loved people with personality disorders and mental illnesses, knowing that harmful actions may be because of the disorder or their abuse doesn't always make the action any less harmful - it's a reason, but it's not always an excuse.
But the fact remains - to a certain extent, my agency is compromised by my disease. There are choices I am unable to make because making them would make my anxiety trip up so high that I hyperventilate, or because because depression convinces me that the choice doesn't exist. And sometimes - when my illness and their illness clash against each other, or I'm panicking and lash out at people because between fight or fight my mind settles on 'fight' and aims at whoever's nearby - I have hurt people, and made choices that damaged myself and others.
(There is something inside of my brain that I cannot control - something inside of me is /broken/ and I can't fix it and I don't always know how to stop hurting people and I /hate/ it. I haven't hurt someone beyond repair, but I live in terror that one day I will. I know how it feels, to be torn apart.)
But if i'm not responsible for what happens when my brain isn't under my control, then neither are the people who have hurt me. If they bear full responsibility for what they do in the grips of the illness, so do I. Are those the only choices?
It is everyone's responsibility to minimize the damage they do to others - but that choice isn't always theirs to make. And I don't know how to move on from that, how much I should forgive myself for my actions and forgive them for theirs. I don't have a narrative for this - it's either unforgivable or there's nothing to forgive, and that's not reality, and it's not helpful.
I think this might be why Kylo Ren has lingered in my head, why the issue of his agency and responsibility is compelling to me. If he is mentally ill, then it's clearly not being effectively treated - and almost certainly being encouraged by Snoke in order to make him easier to control. His agency has been compromised - but how much, and does that matter? The damage is still done, and the people he's killed are still dead. He had the choice to leave the Order - Finn makes that clear to everyone - but did he know that? What about killing Han Solo? He clearly didn't /want/ to do it, and he was given an out - an out that for whatever reason he did not take.
Is there a way forward for him? Is there a space between pawn and monster, between "not your fault" and "completely within your control"?
That's what I want - not even a redemption arc, as such, though I'm not sure there's a better word. I want to see his mistakes /and/ his compromised agency acknowledged, both the choices he made and the choices he couldn't make - and I want to see him live with them both. See him turn to the light and still live with the dark inside of him. I want to see him accept responsibility and also accept forgiveness - for him know what his illness drives him to do and not use that as an excuse for hurting people - and for him to keep walking forward.
We don't get to see that kind of a story. So the sins are acknowledged and the wounds are seen - now what the hell do you do? How do you heal, from what was done to you and what you've done to others?
We never got to see Anakin try and live with what he had done. Is self-destruction out of guilt the only option? Or can you live for atonement - striving to do good, to /be/ good, believing that you will never reach it?
I want a narrative that I can use to navigate between my illnesses and everyone else's safety, between their illnesses and /my/ safety. Am I made irredeemable because of my illness? Are people who hurt me blameless because of /their/ illness? I want a third option. And in Kylo Ren there is the possibility for one.
Is there a way to balance all of these things in Kylo Ren? They seem to cancel each other out. He will function less as a subversion if compromised agency is a factor. That Guy hardly needs told that his actions aren't his fault - he will do that entirely on his own. It's one of his most insiduous traits. But at the same time, if Kylo Ren does not have the chance to redeem himself, will that threaten That Guy's self-image or just confirm it? (If he is doomed to be a monster then he will revel in his monstrousity - that point of view is a part of the problem to begin with.) And is him being a subversion more important than dealing with the consequences of abuse and illness - and is it possible for him to be /both/?
I'm not certain. I'm not sure there's a way in between all of these seemingly competing potentials. But I know what I would /like/ to see - that third option, where sins are acknowledged and so is the potental for redemption, where responsibility and forgiveness can coexist. And I want to see Kylo Ren live with both - both what was done to him and what he has done to others.
I'm not asking for absolution. I don't want the slate wiped clean, because it can't be. The damage has been done - the wounds exist, and no matter how neatly they're stiched up, they are going to leave scars that all of the apologies won't fix.
So show Kylo Ren paying for it, painfully and hesitantly. Not absolution, but atonement. Arguments with Poe where the damage he has done is drilled into his head - Finn silent and judging, "if I left, then so could you," - the knowledge that Rey has every right to not forgive him for what he has done to her, every right to not trust him. Show That Guy learning and growing as a person, accepting that he is at fault and moving forward, so that That Guy knows he has no excuse not to do it himself.
and - this might be my personal bias - I would find it much more compelling, to watch a man who had become a monster learning how to be a man again, learning how to live with what he had done. To watch a man strive for a goodness he doesn't believe he'll ever reach. That is more interesting than watching That Guy getting his ass kicked - and to me, more important.
Will the movies go there? I don't know yet. I honestly don't know if they'll have the space in the story for it - dealing with this in all the complexity I would like would require an entire movie on its own, and that's space that might be better served paying attention to Rey and Finn. (If the options are "kylo ren growing as a person" vs "finn and rey screentime" - well, that's not a hard choice. All of the Rey, please.)
Then again, if they don't write that story, I may well do it myself. Figure out the solution to my problems through writing them out - feel out the options through my writing, and sort things out for myself. I want the answer to this question - I want people to know that there /is/ a question - but I can find it myself, if I have to.
And yet, and yet. My attention goes where it will, and there's a lot more going on than that. There's something /compelling/ about this boy to me, and I want to poke around in his brain. One of the main questions currently, considering his backstory, his behavior, and the patterns of Star Wars- will he get a redemption arc? And on the meta level - /should/ he?
There are several issues that interact here, which makes things complicated. A meta analysis functions on two levels - its interactions with the culture is exists in and its interaction with the reader in question. Obviously, these two things are iterative - my reaction is a part of the culture and the culture is made up of a collection of individual reactions. But basically, it boils down to what it means to Society and what it means to Me. Both are important to that question of "should"- but they're not always the same thing.
Every social group in nerd culture has That Guy. He's the guy who brags about his kill count in games but whenever you play a co-op with him he fucks up and blames lag or cheaters. He's the guy who invents new bullshit powers in a table top rpg just so that his character is always the most overpowered on the board. He'll talk down to you for not having the entire back catalog of a comic or for not having memorized the entire lore of a world - but it's okay, because he's willing to teach you, especially if that means he can flirt with you or get a date for 'helping.' He's that guy who's just a /little/ too into Heath Ledger's Joker. He is the bane of every convention, the curse of any message board, and everyone's least favorite person in a campaign. He will throw an absolute fit if a game doesn't go his way, or if a campaign gets out of his control, or if - heaven forbid - a girl turns him down.
I am willing to bet that 75% of the people in nerd culture, especially those who presented female at the time, have a particular person in mind when reading that description. We have /all/ known this boy. I've probably known five or six of them myself. (I don't doubt that female versions exist, but I haven't personally encountered one.) It is very possible that, if a female-presenting person gets turned away from nerd culture, or gets the impression that it's not for them and that there's no place in it for them, it's because of That Guy.
Give That Guy a light saber and the black coat his mother won't let him buy, and you would get something pretty close to how Kylo Ren acts in the movie. I know several people who have had a visceral negative reaction to the character, because they recognized That Guy and That Guy ruined their fucking week at least once.
For decades, That Guy was a powerful force in nerd culture. Grimdark is aimed specifically at him - fuel for his power fantasies, with beautiful women who fall over him and every excuse to wreak violence on the world without repurcussions. The media was created for him, and supported his view of himself and the world. If it did not support his view, it would be ignored or re-interpreted until it did. (Think of the reputation for badassery that Boba Fett has, which in the context of the OT is /completely unearned/.) For decades, the Star Wars fandom was indemic with Those Guys, and many of them feel that Star Wars is theirs.
Kylo Ren is That Guy - but he was not created for him. He is not a power fantasy but the subversion of one. He is what That Guy looks like to everyone else - not powerful, not fearsome, not in control. All of the darkness and growling and drama is a bluff and the movie makes it incredibly clear that /everyone can tell/. He is as clear a sign post as you can get - this story is not catering to That Guy. Star Wars does not belong to That Guy, and they want That Guy to know it.
And personally, that is /fucking amazing/. Between the villain Kylo Ren and the heroine Ray, there is a now a spot in Star Wars for me. Suddenly, a universe that has been a part of the background radiation of my life is fully open to me - the people who would exclude me from it have no right to, and the text itself makes sure that they know that they are the villians in this story. If Kylo Ren stays as he is, without redemption or any justification, he will already have done something important. I know a lot of people who want him to stay the way he is, because really, fuck That Guy. And that is important and valid!
But I react a little bit differently, and it took me a few weeks to figure out why.
This is the point where I move into conjecture. This is not canon, though I like to think it is, at least, canon-supported. This is why I, personally, /want/ him to get a redemption arc - though I'm not certain that's the best term.
I've read, well, a lot of Kylo Ren fic lately. And I've noticed certain patterns - a lot of people, especially those who are marginally sympathetic to him, write him as mentally ill. Now, most people don't pin a diagnosis to him (possibly because mentally ill villains are a goddamned minefield, which I'll get into in a moment) but they do ascribe a set of symptoms to him that I recognize: biploar disorder. Specifically, his impulsiveness, temper, and lack of self control are written (perhaps unintentionally) as signs of a manic episode. I've also seen paranoid schizophrenic suggested, as well as other disorders. It's generally agreed - there is /something/ wrong here.
If Kylo Ren was taken in by Snoke as a child, as I've seen evidence for, then that adds abuse and grooming to the balance. Abuse, especially as long term and systemic as this would have been, would also contribute to emotional instability and poor impulse control. Mental illness makes one vulnerable to manipulation, and the manipulation worsens underlying mental illness.
(Full disclosure: I am not bipolar, nor was I abused as Kylo seems to have been. I do, however, have chronic depression, anxiety issues, and delusions. Also, this section has been checked over by someone who /is/ bipolar, and has my gratitude for the second set of eyes.)
The problem here is that mental illness (and abuse, which is usually folded in) and villiany have a long and unpleasant history. There are two main narratives on mental illness and villainy in fiction. There is the serial killer who is sick in the mind, who was born evil and has to be locked up for the good of the world before they hurt people - and then there's the idea that it's not their fault, they don't know any better, they can't help it.
And I hate both of these narratives.
As someone who is mentally ill, I can't stand the idea that I was doomed from birth to become a monster, that I am nothing more than a function of my disease. As someone who loves and has loved people with personality disorders and mental illnesses, knowing that harmful actions may be because of the disorder or their abuse doesn't always make the action any less harmful - it's a reason, but it's not always an excuse.
But the fact remains - to a certain extent, my agency is compromised by my disease. There are choices I am unable to make because making them would make my anxiety trip up so high that I hyperventilate, or because because depression convinces me that the choice doesn't exist. And sometimes - when my illness and their illness clash against each other, or I'm panicking and lash out at people because between fight or fight my mind settles on 'fight' and aims at whoever's nearby - I have hurt people, and made choices that damaged myself and others.
(There is something inside of my brain that I cannot control - something inside of me is /broken/ and I can't fix it and I don't always know how to stop hurting people and I /hate/ it. I haven't hurt someone beyond repair, but I live in terror that one day I will. I know how it feels, to be torn apart.)
But if i'm not responsible for what happens when my brain isn't under my control, then neither are the people who have hurt me. If they bear full responsibility for what they do in the grips of the illness, so do I. Are those the only choices?
It is everyone's responsibility to minimize the damage they do to others - but that choice isn't always theirs to make. And I don't know how to move on from that, how much I should forgive myself for my actions and forgive them for theirs. I don't have a narrative for this - it's either unforgivable or there's nothing to forgive, and that's not reality, and it's not helpful.
I think this might be why Kylo Ren has lingered in my head, why the issue of his agency and responsibility is compelling to me. If he is mentally ill, then it's clearly not being effectively treated - and almost certainly being encouraged by Snoke in order to make him easier to control. His agency has been compromised - but how much, and does that matter? The damage is still done, and the people he's killed are still dead. He had the choice to leave the Order - Finn makes that clear to everyone - but did he know that? What about killing Han Solo? He clearly didn't /want/ to do it, and he was given an out - an out that for whatever reason he did not take.
Is there a way forward for him? Is there a space between pawn and monster, between "not your fault" and "completely within your control"?
That's what I want - not even a redemption arc, as such, though I'm not sure there's a better word. I want to see his mistakes /and/ his compromised agency acknowledged, both the choices he made and the choices he couldn't make - and I want to see him live with them both. See him turn to the light and still live with the dark inside of him. I want to see him accept responsibility and also accept forgiveness - for him know what his illness drives him to do and not use that as an excuse for hurting people - and for him to keep walking forward.
We don't get to see that kind of a story. So the sins are acknowledged and the wounds are seen - now what the hell do you do? How do you heal, from what was done to you and what you've done to others?
We never got to see Anakin try and live with what he had done. Is self-destruction out of guilt the only option? Or can you live for atonement - striving to do good, to /be/ good, believing that you will never reach it?
I want a narrative that I can use to navigate between my illnesses and everyone else's safety, between their illnesses and /my/ safety. Am I made irredeemable because of my illness? Are people who hurt me blameless because of /their/ illness? I want a third option. And in Kylo Ren there is the possibility for one.
Is there a way to balance all of these things in Kylo Ren? They seem to cancel each other out. He will function less as a subversion if compromised agency is a factor. That Guy hardly needs told that his actions aren't his fault - he will do that entirely on his own. It's one of his most insiduous traits. But at the same time, if Kylo Ren does not have the chance to redeem himself, will that threaten That Guy's self-image or just confirm it? (If he is doomed to be a monster then he will revel in his monstrousity - that point of view is a part of the problem to begin with.) And is him being a subversion more important than dealing with the consequences of abuse and illness - and is it possible for him to be /both/?
I'm not certain. I'm not sure there's a way in between all of these seemingly competing potentials. But I know what I would /like/ to see - that third option, where sins are acknowledged and so is the potental for redemption, where responsibility and forgiveness can coexist. And I want to see Kylo Ren live with both - both what was done to him and what he has done to others.
I'm not asking for absolution. I don't want the slate wiped clean, because it can't be. The damage has been done - the wounds exist, and no matter how neatly they're stiched up, they are going to leave scars that all of the apologies won't fix.
So show Kylo Ren paying for it, painfully and hesitantly. Not absolution, but atonement. Arguments with Poe where the damage he has done is drilled into his head - Finn silent and judging, "if I left, then so could you," - the knowledge that Rey has every right to not forgive him for what he has done to her, every right to not trust him. Show That Guy learning and growing as a person, accepting that he is at fault and moving forward, so that That Guy knows he has no excuse not to do it himself.
and - this might be my personal bias - I would find it much more compelling, to watch a man who had become a monster learning how to be a man again, learning how to live with what he had done. To watch a man strive for a goodness he doesn't believe he'll ever reach. That is more interesting than watching That Guy getting his ass kicked - and to me, more important.
Will the movies go there? I don't know yet. I honestly don't know if they'll have the space in the story for it - dealing with this in all the complexity I would like would require an entire movie on its own, and that's space that might be better served paying attention to Rey and Finn. (If the options are "kylo ren growing as a person" vs "finn and rey screentime" - well, that's not a hard choice. All of the Rey, please.)
Then again, if they don't write that story, I may well do it myself. Figure out the solution to my problems through writing them out - feel out the options through my writing, and sort things out for myself. I want the answer to this question - I want people to know that there /is/ a question - but I can find it myself, if I have to.
no subject
So show Kylo Ren paying for it, painfully and hesitantly. Not absolution, but atonement. Arguments with Poe where the damage he has done is drilled into his head - Finn silent and judging, "if I left, then so could you," - the knowledge that Rey has every right to not forgive him for what he has done to her, every right to not trust him.
No, seriously, you should watch Avatar: The Last Airbender.
i accidentally an essay. again.
Thanks so much! I'm so glad you like it.
Honestly, the conflicting desires has been bothering me, a little bit. LIke, So Many People on my dash have the reaction of "you know what, fuck That Guy" and complain about people trying to justify Kylo Ren's actions based on his childhood, or that people aren't paying enough attention to Finn or Rey. And that's totally fair! Horus knows that woobification is a problem with his character type, and that those characters are likely to be ignored. Their emotional reactions are valid
I'm trying to understand and justify /why/ he's compelling to me while /not/ woobifying him, but I'll admit there's a certain defensiveness to it. I'm paying attention to the Wrong Character, and it's clearly only because of internal bias that I'm not spending all of my energy on Finn, or Rey. By writing about Kylo, I am Part of the Problem. Because clearly, /my/ emotional reactions are not valid and must be corrected, or at least made justified.
(I don't know if this is a result of the current fandom atmosphere, people in general, or simply my lack of confidence. Quite possibly a confluence of the three.)
But it's - not their fault that they have a particular desire for what the narrative and by extention the fandom should provide, and conversely (if all things are equal, which I am forced to conceed) my desires shouldn't be my fault either. Just because my desires for the narrative happen to look superficially like what Villain Apologists want, that doesn't make them invalid. (If it quacks like a duck and floats like a duck, it might be a clever bath toy - or a goose.)
...that kind of turned into an essay there, but yeah, that's the headspace that this post is coming from. Trying to balance what seem to be competing needs for validation, and what I want vs what other people want. (Speaking of questions we don't have answers for...)
And yeah, I think my version would work as a subversion - I just honestly don't know if they're going to go for it. They only have two movies to do this in, and to do this /right/ it's gonna require a lot of subtle writing and acting - there's no neat way to do it, no easy solution, and that would leave a lot of people unsatisfied. Is it cynical to worry that a lot of the audience wouldn't get it? That they'll take it as "see he's not all bad" rather than "even the worst of us are still capable of growth"? Blrg. I'd write it myself, but I'm not sure I'm up to it either.
also, re: avatar - I see that! When I get my hands on it, I will watch it straight away. (Things that Star needs: netflix. Related things that Star needs: A Job)
Thank you for the help in writing it!
You're being so articulate, and I'm just all over the place
I do think it's all three. I mean, I think people like us are hyper-aware of whether we're doing something "wrong." (If you don't object me lumping us together. I may be off base.) And, yeah, people are going to be people, which involves hypocrisy and being judgmental. But fandom has always had this tension between "If you love terrible characters, then you are terrible" and "If you don't love terrible characters, then you are terrible." And while I think the great fandom social justice awakening of the past few years has been an overall net gain, it has intensified this tension. If you like a character who's a bad person, then you support all their actions, and you're pro-abuse. If you dislike a character who's a bad person, then you support everything bad that was done to them, and you're pro-abuse.
But, like, I'm seriously surprised by the amount of hate Rey/Kylo gets, because I don't see much that distinguishes it from a dozen other hero/villain pairings. I think fandom needs to chill the fuck out, but I suppose there's never been a time when fandom didn't need to chill the fuck out for one reason or another.
I think this is a fantastic essay, and I'm glad you wrote it, but if you like Kylo Ren and want to see him redeemed, I don't think you need to justify yourself. I don't think you like the wrong character. I'm not saying you're irrational for feeling defensive, because I don't think you are. I'm more saying... fuck 'em if they can't take a joke.
Of course, I do appreciate it when you explain yourself, because you make me see things in a new light. Like, I'm not kidding, here was my sequence of thought during TFA:
Thought one: Ugh, I don't like Kylo Ren at all.
Thought two: I bet
Thought three: I'll have to have her explain him to me, so I can appreciate him better.
And you did!
Regarding Avatar, I don't know if this is too pushy (if it is I'll back right off), but I could mail you my DVDs, and you could mail them back whenever you were ready. (The show's on Amazon Prime, which I have, so you wouldn't be depriving me.) Nothing is more dangerous than over-hype, but I'd at least love to hear your take on it.)
no subject
Yeah. I want people I admire to approve of me! Which is a totally natural instinct, I'm sure, it just backfires sometimes. (I am totally okay with lumping together. You're good company.) And yeah, that's part of the issue - on the one hand, it's better that fandom isn't a wild-west moral free for all, and analysis and criticism of the culture of fandom is important. But there's also the fact that fandom responses are incredibly personal, and reflective of both personal philosophies and emotional background - which means that people get defensive, and that it matters. The line between "this is meaningless enjoyment" and "this determines the course of culture" is a little blurry, now.
I think the thing with Rey/Kylo is partially the abuse dynamics - he invaded her mind, "I get what I want", etc - and partially because it is in competition with Rey/Finn and Rey/Finn is not winning out. And maybe that's a racism thing, or maybe it's that they want Rey to 'fix' Kylo's obvious brokenness, or whatever. (Maybe Kylo and Rey are the most notable stars in the movie for some people, and people naturally shove them together.)
Also, <3 Thanks. Both for the validation, and for compliments. I'm - flattered and amused that that was your thought process. (I do have Types of Characters, don't I.) I helped you appreciate him more? I suppose that's the most a writer can hope for in explaining a character <33
If you're comfortable with them in the mail, I - will consider that. Not 100% sure right now, but I appreciate the offer! I do want to watch Avatar, but I will have to think about it for a bit.